Daniel Dae Kim on ‘Asian-Americans’: Ugly History, Relevant Again
金大贤谈《亚裔美国人》：当种族主义的历史照进现实

In late March, the actor Daniel Dae Kim posted a video on Instagram revealing that he had tested positive for Covid-19. Back then Kim, best known for memorable roles on “Lost” and “Hawaii Five-0,” was one of the early well-known carriers of the coronavirus, having potentially contracted it while filming his NBC medical drama “New Amsterdam” in New York City. He documented his recovery process online while most Americans were just beginning to comprehend the impact of the pandemic.
3月下旬，演员金大贤(Daniel Dae Kim)在Instagram上发布了一段视频，透露其Covid-19检测呈阳性。金大贤曾因在《迷失》(Lost)和《天堂执法者》(Hawaii Five-0)中扮演令人印象深刻的角色而闻名，他是较早染上新冠病毒的名人之一，可能是在纽约市拍摄NBC医疗剧《医院革命》(New Amsterdam)时感染的。当大多数美国人才刚刚开始了解疫情带来的影响时，他就已经在网上记录了他的康复过程。

Since then, Kim has felt close to normal, despite some lingering effects — the occasional disappearance of his senses of smell and taste, some issues with focus. He has continued to be active in the fight against the virus and its fallout, donating his plasma, raising money for health care professionals and condemning the anti-Asian xenophobia and attacks that have been on the rise in the age of the coronavirus.
从那以后，金大贤感觉恢复得差不多了，尽管有一些遗留的症状——他的嗅觉和味觉偶尔会消失，还有一些注意力集中的问题。他继续积极抗击病毒及其造成的波动，捐赠血浆，为医疗保健专业人员筹集资金，并谴责新冠病毒时代日趋增多的反亚裔的仇外心理和袭击行为。

“I don’t necessarily see my activity as a responsibility,” Kim said in an interview. “My only goal was to be informative and helpful for those who were fearful or had no reference point.”
“我并非要把我做的事情看成是履行责任，”金大贤在接受采访时说。“我唯一的目标是为那些恐惧或没有头绪的人提供信息和帮助。”

Kim, though, was largely uninterested in talking about himself during a recent Zoom call. Instead, he wanted to discuss “Asian-Americans,” the new documentary series he narrates with the actress Tamlyn Tomita. Premiering Monday on PBS, the five-part special is the most ambitious documentary project ever to chronicle the history of the Asian-American community. It is arriving with an unanticipated relevance, amid the surge of racism toward Asian-Americans during the pandemic.
不过在最近的Zoom通话中，金大贤并不愿谈论自己，而是想讨论与女演员富田谭玲一起担任旁白的新纪录片系列《亚裔美国人》(Asian-Americans)。这部由五个部分组成的特别节目周一在美国公共电视网(PBS)首映，是有史以来最雄心勃勃的记录亚裔美国人历史的纪录片项目。巧的是，该系列纪录片的播出恰逢新冠疫情期间，针对亚裔的种族歧视激增。

Beginning in the 1850s and continuing into the present, the series covers an expansive arc that has often been ignored within America’s self-concept: from Angel Island to the impact of the Filipino-American labor movement, from the radical third world movement to the murder of Vincent Chin in 1982. It is a story of discrimination, marginalization and violence — and an affirmation of a community that persistently rose in the face of hardship.
从1850年代到现在，该系列涵盖了美国的自我概念中经常遭到忽略的一段漫长的历史弧线：从天使岛到菲裔美国人劳工运动的影响，从激进的第三世界运动到1982年陈果仁遇害事件。这是一个关于歧视、边缘化和暴力的故事，也是对一个在困难中不断成长的群体的肯定。

Kim spoke about the documentary’s lessons for today, what it means to be considered “American” and what his fight with coronavirus revealed to him about the country. Here are edited excerpts from the conversation.
金大贤谈到了该纪录片对今天的启示、被视为“美国人”的意味，以及与新冠病毒的斗争所揭示的这个国家的一些本质。以下是经过编辑的对话摘录。

A project of this scope has never really existed until now. Why is that?
这种规模的纪录片直到现在才有。这是为什么？

That’s a very loaded question. I think it speaks to our place in American society and how we’ve been perceived up until today and including today. We have been a part of the fabric of this country, and yet we’ve been overlooked relative to other minorities. Though we have worked really hard to assimilate collectively, events that are depicted in this documentary, as well as in the news today, show us that we really aren’t considered as American as most others.
这是一个很能说明问题的问题。我认为这反映了我们在美国社会中的地位，以及直到现在，甚至包括今天人们对我们的看法。我们是这个国家的一份子，但是相对于其他少数族裔，我们一直被忽略。尽管我们付出了极大的努力去集体同化，但这部纪录片所描述的事件，以及当今的新闻告诉我们，我们真的不像其他大多数人那样被视为美国人。

Do you see a parallel between the history that the series documents and what the Asian-American community is facing now as a result of the coronavirus?
在纪录片中记录的历史和亚裔群体目前面临的困境之间，你认为有相似之处吗？

One of the chapters that is most relevant right now is the story of Japanese internment in the 1940s, where American citizens born and raised in this country had their rights stripped away from them, their property taken from them, their businesses confiscated, and were put into essentially prison camps solely based on how they looked. What is amazing to me, whenever I talk about this particular part of our history, is how many people have never heard of it before. When I talk about the 442nd or the 100th battalion, people don’t know what that is. People don’t know that we had Asian-Americans fighting for this country as their families were interned.
与目前的情形最相关的年代之一，是40年代日裔被送进集中营，当时，在美国出生并长大的公民权利被剥夺，财产被攫取，生意被没收，并仅仅根据他们的外貌而被关进与监狱大同小异的集中营。每当我谈到这部分特别的历史时，令我感到惊讶的是，许多人从未听说过。当我说起第442步兵团或第100营时，人们不知道那是什么。人们不知道有亚裔美国人——在他们的家人被拘禁的时候——在为这个国家而战。

This documentary chronicles our place in this country and how much a part of it we are, and in that way it’s also a celebration of how American we are. And when we have op-ed pieces about how “American” we should be, even today, it’s a reminder that we’ve been asking these questions throughout American history.
这部纪录片记载了我们在这个国家的位置，以及我们在这个国家的重要性，它也是对我们美国人身份的一种庆祝。即使到今天，当我们发表应该怎样做“美国人”的观点文章时，这也提醒着我们，在整个美国历史中，我们一直在问这些问题。

The episode on Japanese-American internment told the story of the Uno family. Some of them were soldiers fighting for America in World War II at the same time that America was putting their relatives in camps. Buddy Uno ultimately became a journalist and propagandist in and for Japan, and I felt a complex sense of empathy for him, given how his family was treated. How do you see him?
日裔美国人遭拘禁的那一集讲述了宇野一家的故事。他们家有几个人是第二次世界大战中为美国而战的士兵，与此同时，美国把他们的亲人关进了集中营。巴迪·宇野(Buddy Uno)最终成为为日本工作的记者和宣传者，看到他家人的遭遇，我对他有一种复杂的同理心。你怎么看他？

It’s understandable that one would take Buddy’s position. And yet not a single Japanese-American was convicted of espionage or treason against the United States. That says so much to me; what will it take for us to be considered American? I think that’s a central question of this documentary, as you see even today elderly Asian-Americans being beaten and taunted in the midst of this virus.
站在巴迪的立场上，是可以理解的。然而，没有一个日裔美国人被判犯有间谍罪或叛国罪。这对我来说很有意义；我们要付出什么样的代价才能被认为是美国人？我认为这是本片的中心问题，就像你看到的，即使在今天，在疫情中，年长的亚裔美国人还会遭到殴打和嘲弄。

You mentioned op-eds about that central question. Andrew Yang was recently criticized for his column calling on Asian-Americans to show their “Americanness” amid the crisis. What’s your reaction to this idea?
你提到了关于这个中心问题的一些专栏文章。最近，杨安泽(Andrew Yang)因在专栏中呼吁亚裔美国人在危机中表现出“美国性”而受到批评。你对这个观点有什么看法？

It is important for every American to be proud of their country and to do whatever they can to be the best “American” that they can. But no one should have to prove that they’re American. The same standard should apply to everyone regardless of what color their skin is and what religion they follow.
所有美国人都应该为自己的国家感到骄傲，尽自己所能成为最好的“美国人”，这一点很重要。但没人需要证明自己是美国人。同样的标准应该适用于所有人，无论他们是什么肤色，信仰什么宗教。

Has the rise in anti-Asian racism made you think differently about the documentary’s potential impact?
反亚洲种族主义的兴起，是否让你对这部纪录片的潜在影响有了不同的看法？

It makes it all the more important that people understand and see that this has happened in the past. There’s that saying about those who forget history are condemned to repeat it — this is a way of hopefully preventing history from repeating itself. The one phrase that I always think about from “Hamilton” is: Are you going to be on the right side of history? As today’s chapter of our nation’s history is being written, which side will we be on? And which side will you be on?
更重要的是，人们应当理解并认识到过去曾经发生过这样的事情。有句谚语说，忘记历史的人注定要重蹈覆辙——这是希望防止历史重演的一种方式。我经常想到《汉密尔顿》(Hamilton)里的一句话：你会站在历史的正确一边吗？如今我们的国家正在书写历史的篇章，我们要站在哪一边？你要站在哪一边?

If there’s a chance to scapegoat one another, it seems to be part of the daily playbook for some of our leaders. How can it be a surprise that the population feels that way when we see it in our leadership? It’s heartbreaking, and it’s tragic.
我们一些领导人的部分日常工作好像就是在互相推卸责任。看到这些领导者的时候，人们怎么可能不产生这样的感觉呢？这令人心碎，令人悲伤。

As someone who had the virus, how do you respond to the idea of being blamed, as an Asian-American, for the pandemic?
作为一个感染过这种病毒的人，作为一个亚裔美国人，你对那种指责亚裔为大流行罪魁祸首的想法怎么看？

Thankfully I haven’t really experienced anything firsthand, person-to-person. But in sharing my experience with the virus, I exposed myself to the worst of online humanity. It was eye-opening and very discouraging. I firmly believe now that there’s a segment of the population that will forever consider anyone other than them outsiders.
值得庆幸的是，对此我还没有面对面的亲身体验过。但在分享自己对抗病毒的经历时，我体验了网络人性最恶劣的一面。让人大开眼界，也非常令人沮丧。我确信，现在有一部分人会永远把其他人视为局外人。

We could use more emphasis on unity. This special is not a way of saying Asian-Americans are different and therefore special. It’s really saying, Asian-Americans are part of this country’s history and therefore are special.
我们本来可以更注重团结。这个特别节目并不是说亚裔美国人是与众不同的，因此是特别的。这个节目是在说，亚裔美国人是这个国家历史的一部分，所以才是特别的。

In the series, moments of tragedy or persecution are, in fact, what repeatedly spurred political action and solidarity among Asian-Americans.
事实上，在这个系列中，悲剧或迫害的时刻不断地刺激着亚裔美国人采取政治行动、团结起来。

I think it’s true of every minority in this country. All of these movements were borne of tragedy. Pressure makes diamonds. All of these events have culminated in Asian-Americans being more galvanized then we ever have been. This special is the result of that galvanization.
我认为这个国家的每一个少数族裔都是如此。所有这些运动都带有悲剧色彩。钻石是在高压之下诞生的。所有这些事件都对亚裔美国人带来了前所未有的刺激。这部片子就是受到刺激的结果。

What do you hope the impact of the series will be for viewers, Asian-American and not?
你希望这个系列对亚裔观众和非亚裔观众产生什么样的影响？

For Asian-Americans, I would hope that we can see that we belong here as much as anyone else, and that we can take pride in our contributions to this country’s history. We’ve contributed in positive ways toward this country’s growth, but some of the ways in which we’ve suffered have also contributed to this country’s growth. It is both a positive and a negative, but that is exactly what being a part of the fabric of America means.
对于亚裔美国人来说，我希望我们能够看到，我们和其他人一样属于这里，我们可以为自己对这个国家历史的贡献感到自豪。我们以积极的方式为这个国家的发展做出了贡献，但我们遭受的一些痛苦也为这个国家的发展做出了贡献。这既有积极的一面，也有消极的一面，但这正是融入美国的意义所在。

We don’t want to be speaking just to ourselves. What’s really important is to have this history brought out to the general population so that people who have no idea of what our contributions might be or have been finally understand that they are significant and they are real. I would hope that it’s a celebration of what it means to be American. If we can redefine that word to be inclusive of every group that contributes to this country, then the documentary will have done a real service.
我们不想只是自说自话。真正重要的是将这段历史带给大众，让那些不了解我们的贡献的人最终明白，我们的贡献是重要的、是真实的。我希望这是在歌颂身为美国人的意义。如果我们能重新定义“美国人”这个词，让它可以容纳对这个国家做出贡献的所有群体，那么这部纪录片就算是做出了真正的贡献。

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